Post by Yetsuna Yishnir on May 20, 2018 19:50:41 GMT -5
As the title says I'm leaving the forum for the foreseeable future as a protest against a decision to ban my main character Yetsuna.
Most of you have likely seen some of what has occured or heard about it in discord, but I still want to recap the events so everyone as a better idea what's occurred.
First and foremost I will acknowledge this all stemmed from me, I was the one that initially escalated, but I have the belief that there are several ways any mod could have intervened and helped prevent it from reaching this level. I will do my best to include all relevant details in an effort to make the story neutral, but the time span and number of people involved may cause me to leave out details.
This initially started with a CIU I submitted back on February 18th. The CIU was to change a line in Yetsuna's power clarifying how a mechanic worked because what was written did not reflect what actually occurred (what was there initially was stronger then what was changed). The CIU remained untouched for 7 weeks, during which time I did not bother the mods about it. Finally on the 9th of April Sana looked over the changes and posed a fairly simple question about it and I responded fairly quickly. There was no reply just under 4 weeks.
During that wait Z brought to my attention that I had left a mechanic out of the clean-up/rewrite I had done back in August of last year so I went to go write the mechanic into the CIU (The mechanic was Yetsuna insta-summon defensive stone). I did that at about the 3 and a half week point, Sana came back at about 4 weeks. At this point I was already somewhat frustrated with this process, I had initially changed a single line and I had been waiting 3 months to get it graded.
When Sana came back to grade she decided to review all of Yetsuna powers, which, while her right has a mod, I pushed back against. The reason I pushed back was because it had been less than 12 months since I had been forced to do a power regrade, in that time due to my work schedule I had managed to complete a single thread and only had two others in progress. It was also the second time that I had a full power regrade dropped on my head for CIU’s I didn’t need to do, but wanted to do for clarity’s sake. I basically begged Sana to just let it slide for now because I really didn’t want to go through a regrade because I knew it would end up being painful and a lot of work, but that plea was rejected at which point I started escalating and forcefully denying the grading and pushing back on the proposed changes due to what they would mean for my character. Sana wanted to reduce her stones speed to 600 (from scaling with her SpPr) and reduce the speed and ease of use of her stone phasing ability. The main issue that got argued about was the stones speed, at which point I brought up examples why such a nerf wasn’t needed for balancing (though I later acknowledged the need for a cap, but that will be discussed later). I talked about my thread with Rucho’s hollow and how, with 100 speed, 100 instinct, and no battle analysis he managed to perceive and react to her stone basically without fail and was told that was within the scope of reason. Using that as a basis (because almost everyone has those stats or better) I argued that nerfing her stones speed was an unneeded and ineffective nerf to a non-existent problem. I still have not heard a mod address this argument.
Most of what I’ve talked about now had been done in discord with PM’s between me and Sana. It was around now I started talking to Col because I was frustrated and insanely angry and I needed someone to vent to. At some point, I forget exactly when, I got so excessively frustrated and angry, I more or less caved to Sana’s grading (with the exception of the stone phasing) wrote in the changes and replied to the grading, albeit with attitude. Sana lashed out in a reply and made Yetsuna an illegal character pending completion of the CIU. Zk and Z both chimed in around this time, their comments are on record in the CIU thread (link at the bottom). I initially saw Zk’s reply and started writing a reply talking about why I got so angry and pushed back, explaining why I did what I did and the reasons for my emotions. It was around here I started to own the fact I fucked up in how I handled the situation, though I did not apologize for it and I still refuse to because none of the mods have acknowledged how I felt during this entire event.
It was in that reply that I also began to come around slightly on some nerfs for Yetsuna because I had been talking with Col, who was also the reason I was starting to calm down instead of continuing to lash out and push against the mods. I agreed a speed cap on her powers was something that was needed for balance reasons, but I still pushed against a speed nerf because no one had addressed my argument about Rucho’s hollow and his reactions. Talking with Col yielded several ways in which Yetsuna would be broken if I choose to abuse her powers, though none of the idea’s he had put forward were things I would have thought of and none of them related to her stone’s speed, but rather other mechanics in her powers. With a bit of prodding for Col I also acknowledged Yetsuna’s powers were a little broad and needed to get a little more specialized.
Despite the fact I still hated that I had to do the CIU I begrudgingly decided to move forward with it, if for no other reason then I didn’t have a choice. At this point I also requested another grader to take over because I didn’t trust myself around Sana and I didn’t trust her ability to be impartial; she refused to give up as the primary grader. I pitched the ideas me and Col and developed over our talks to Sana in discord in an attempt to figure out if the idea was worth trying to follow and to hopefully speed up the grading a bit. 24 hours passed with no reply and after sana had been on and decently active in main chat so I sent a message requesting at least some type of acknowledgement so I knew I wasn’t being ignored, still nothing. At this point I sent it to Bo for an opinion, he liked the idea, I forwarded it to Zk and Z as well. At this point I realized that there was a side-effect to me sending it to other mods: it acted as a form of insurance. I also forwarded it to John.
I realized after sending it to them that, in the event the idea was agreed to be good, it acted to protect me against Sana in the grading where I had a real fear that she would attempt to take retribution of some kind and nerf Yetsuna into the ground, and I would have no way of salvaging her because, from my experiences, the secondary reviewer only tweekes the grading, they don’t over turn. If Sana had tried to do that having the other mods approving of the idea could protect me by allowing me to say “All the other mods thought this was a good idea, why don’t you.” I made no attempted to hide the realization from Z or Bo and told them both I had realized that. Around here PM’s fell off.
I decided I was getting bored with waiting (because I wanted to get back to my captaincy exam) and decided to just throw up the rewrite in hopes that Sana would grade it. In the update reply I mention the fact I had sent it to other people, though I’ll admit a fault that I should have told Sana I sent it out to the mods sooner, though it was from a place of forgetfulness, not malintent. I threw up a reply, in a fairly hopeful mood because I felt the idea’s I had put forward struck a good balance of effective nerfs by actually addressing real issues in her powers while still giving the mods a slight speed nerf. Sana’s reply was a bit snappy from my perspective. I replied, still trying to maintain a good mood, Sana replied and I felt like she was telling me to go fuck myself. I replied again, but no one else did.
A few days later I receive a PM from Sana, with all the other mods included as reciptiants, with screen shot images of everything that had happened 7 days ago with point by point comments. I felt both amusement and anger. Anger because I was trying to move past what had happened and work on the grading in good faith and this message felt like she was too hung up on what had happened to actually do the grading. I felt amusement because she took the time to take (or at the very least copy) all those pictures, embed them and then comment on them. I read through it and forwarded it to Col because honestly, I could believe what I was reading and wanted an outsiders look. He never got to read it, Sana joined voice chat (I left for obvious reasons) but I heard him mention i sent it to him before I left to Sana. He said something a bit later in a PM, I forget exactly what, but basically said he didn’t read it. I also sent it to Kaga because he was curious what I was losing my shit over. There is one line in particular I want to quote from her which really felt like her telling me to go royally fuck myself. It was the start of a paragraph “But if any of that wasn't enough, you decided you no longer wanted to work with me. Fair enough, but unless I agree with that, it's too bad for you. “
Z replied echoing many of Sana’s points and calling me out for sending Col and Kaga the screenshot of Sana’s message because (paraphrasing) “They started the PM for my protection so the members would gossips behind my back.” I wrote out a decently long reply during which I again admitted I fucked up, but standing by my actions and went into details about why I did what I did. The message was seemingly ignored because the next response was Ray basically telling me I’m a piece of shit and informing me the mods voted to a character ban.
I said that if the mods wanted to do that they could, but that I would take the action I am now and leave the site, though not necessarily the discord. I went on to explain how I felt ignored, how no argument or feeling I had out forward in anything and been addressed, I talked about why I pushed back so hard on nerfs against my character, again pulling up Rucho’s hollow as an example. I talked about how I had tried to move forward with a good foot, but how it was seemingly being ignored despite my misstep. Zk replied, largely, point though there was still no acknowledgement of my argument about Rucho’s hollow and the only feeling that got addressed was my anger that Sana felt the need to make her point by point PM in which he basically said “Your actions need consequences”, which, while true, did nothing to justify Sana’s message. At some point I was told the PM was meant to put forward the verdict of the mods about banning my character, though I felt this was false. If the thread had been just about handing down a punishment I feel Ray’s message would have been the first one put forward, not Sana’s, or even if it had been a review of my behavior beforehand it would have taken a more professional tone instead of the shitty one that was given. I still haven’t heard back about this.
I replied, point by point, like Zk did, to his message, though after a bit less than 48 hours I sent another message saying that I’m assuming I wasn’t going to get a reply and that I wanted to mods to taken the ban announcement public. They said it can be taken public, though there was a miscommunication about who would be doing it, I thought the mods would, they thought I would. For fairness reasons I told them I want the thread to be able to replied to so I could correct anything I found inaccurate. They told me I could do it myself and that the PM’s again had been for my benefit, though I still doubt this. Sana replied once more once I said I was going public saying the PM had also been so that a public scene wasn’t made, though I found that argument to be largely invalid by the scene that was already made in the CIU. I would like to post scene shots of the messages that were sent because i think it shows I was really trying to move on and the mods weren’t willing to, but I very much doubt they would approve their release.
That’s the story up to this point. I’ve told it as impartial as I could and owned up in areas where I think I fucked up, though I refrained from pointing out areas where I feel the mods fucked up because I feel it wouldn’t really accomplish much accept piss them off and open the pandora’s box that is “what if”. I was informed in Zk’s last message that the ban may be lifted at a future date, and maybe if it is I’ll come back to RP, though I’m not sure I will, and if I did it would be because of people like Col, who through this entire shit show, has been the one helpful person in this entire ordeal.
Most of you have likely seen some of what has occured or heard about it in discord, but I still want to recap the events so everyone as a better idea what's occurred.
First and foremost I will acknowledge this all stemmed from me, I was the one that initially escalated, but I have the belief that there are several ways any mod could have intervened and helped prevent it from reaching this level. I will do my best to include all relevant details in an effort to make the story neutral, but the time span and number of people involved may cause me to leave out details.
This initially started with a CIU I submitted back on February 18th. The CIU was to change a line in Yetsuna's power clarifying how a mechanic worked because what was written did not reflect what actually occurred (what was there initially was stronger then what was changed). The CIU remained untouched for 7 weeks, during which time I did not bother the mods about it. Finally on the 9th of April Sana looked over the changes and posed a fairly simple question about it and I responded fairly quickly. There was no reply just under 4 weeks.
During that wait Z brought to my attention that I had left a mechanic out of the clean-up/rewrite I had done back in August of last year so I went to go write the mechanic into the CIU (The mechanic was Yetsuna insta-summon defensive stone). I did that at about the 3 and a half week point, Sana came back at about 4 weeks. At this point I was already somewhat frustrated with this process, I had initially changed a single line and I had been waiting 3 months to get it graded.
When Sana came back to grade she decided to review all of Yetsuna powers, which, while her right has a mod, I pushed back against. The reason I pushed back was because it had been less than 12 months since I had been forced to do a power regrade, in that time due to my work schedule I had managed to complete a single thread and only had two others in progress. It was also the second time that I had a full power regrade dropped on my head for CIU’s I didn’t need to do, but wanted to do for clarity’s sake. I basically begged Sana to just let it slide for now because I really didn’t want to go through a regrade because I knew it would end up being painful and a lot of work, but that plea was rejected at which point I started escalating and forcefully denying the grading and pushing back on the proposed changes due to what they would mean for my character. Sana wanted to reduce her stones speed to 600 (from scaling with her SpPr) and reduce the speed and ease of use of her stone phasing ability. The main issue that got argued about was the stones speed, at which point I brought up examples why such a nerf wasn’t needed for balancing (though I later acknowledged the need for a cap, but that will be discussed later). I talked about my thread with Rucho’s hollow and how, with 100 speed, 100 instinct, and no battle analysis he managed to perceive and react to her stone basically without fail and was told that was within the scope of reason. Using that as a basis (because almost everyone has those stats or better) I argued that nerfing her stones speed was an unneeded and ineffective nerf to a non-existent problem. I still have not heard a mod address this argument.
Most of what I’ve talked about now had been done in discord with PM’s between me and Sana. It was around now I started talking to Col because I was frustrated and insanely angry and I needed someone to vent to. At some point, I forget exactly when, I got so excessively frustrated and angry, I more or less caved to Sana’s grading (with the exception of the stone phasing) wrote in the changes and replied to the grading, albeit with attitude. Sana lashed out in a reply and made Yetsuna an illegal character pending completion of the CIU. Zk and Z both chimed in around this time, their comments are on record in the CIU thread (link at the bottom). I initially saw Zk’s reply and started writing a reply talking about why I got so angry and pushed back, explaining why I did what I did and the reasons for my emotions. It was around here I started to own the fact I fucked up in how I handled the situation, though I did not apologize for it and I still refuse to because none of the mods have acknowledged how I felt during this entire event.
It was in that reply that I also began to come around slightly on some nerfs for Yetsuna because I had been talking with Col, who was also the reason I was starting to calm down instead of continuing to lash out and push against the mods. I agreed a speed cap on her powers was something that was needed for balance reasons, but I still pushed against a speed nerf because no one had addressed my argument about Rucho’s hollow and his reactions. Talking with Col yielded several ways in which Yetsuna would be broken if I choose to abuse her powers, though none of the idea’s he had put forward were things I would have thought of and none of them related to her stone’s speed, but rather other mechanics in her powers. With a bit of prodding for Col I also acknowledged Yetsuna’s powers were a little broad and needed to get a little more specialized.
Despite the fact I still hated that I had to do the CIU I begrudgingly decided to move forward with it, if for no other reason then I didn’t have a choice. At this point I also requested another grader to take over because I didn’t trust myself around Sana and I didn’t trust her ability to be impartial; she refused to give up as the primary grader. I pitched the ideas me and Col and developed over our talks to Sana in discord in an attempt to figure out if the idea was worth trying to follow and to hopefully speed up the grading a bit. 24 hours passed with no reply and after sana had been on and decently active in main chat so I sent a message requesting at least some type of acknowledgement so I knew I wasn’t being ignored, still nothing. At this point I sent it to Bo for an opinion, he liked the idea, I forwarded it to Zk and Z as well. At this point I realized that there was a side-effect to me sending it to other mods: it acted as a form of insurance. I also forwarded it to John.
I realized after sending it to them that, in the event the idea was agreed to be good, it acted to protect me against Sana in the grading where I had a real fear that she would attempt to take retribution of some kind and nerf Yetsuna into the ground, and I would have no way of salvaging her because, from my experiences, the secondary reviewer only tweekes the grading, they don’t over turn. If Sana had tried to do that having the other mods approving of the idea could protect me by allowing me to say “All the other mods thought this was a good idea, why don’t you.” I made no attempted to hide the realization from Z or Bo and told them both I had realized that. Around here PM’s fell off.
I decided I was getting bored with waiting (because I wanted to get back to my captaincy exam) and decided to just throw up the rewrite in hopes that Sana would grade it. In the update reply I mention the fact I had sent it to other people, though I’ll admit a fault that I should have told Sana I sent it out to the mods sooner, though it was from a place of forgetfulness, not malintent. I threw up a reply, in a fairly hopeful mood because I felt the idea’s I had put forward struck a good balance of effective nerfs by actually addressing real issues in her powers while still giving the mods a slight speed nerf. Sana’s reply was a bit snappy from my perspective. I replied, still trying to maintain a good mood, Sana replied and I felt like she was telling me to go fuck myself. I replied again, but no one else did.
A few days later I receive a PM from Sana, with all the other mods included as reciptiants, with screen shot images of everything that had happened 7 days ago with point by point comments. I felt both amusement and anger. Anger because I was trying to move past what had happened and work on the grading in good faith and this message felt like she was too hung up on what had happened to actually do the grading. I felt amusement because she took the time to take (or at the very least copy) all those pictures, embed them and then comment on them. I read through it and forwarded it to Col because honestly, I could believe what I was reading and wanted an outsiders look. He never got to read it, Sana joined voice chat (I left for obvious reasons) but I heard him mention i sent it to him before I left to Sana. He said something a bit later in a PM, I forget exactly what, but basically said he didn’t read it. I also sent it to Kaga because he was curious what I was losing my shit over. There is one line in particular I want to quote from her which really felt like her telling me to go royally fuck myself. It was the start of a paragraph “But if any of that wasn't enough, you decided you no longer wanted to work with me. Fair enough, but unless I agree with that, it's too bad for you. “
Z replied echoing many of Sana’s points and calling me out for sending Col and Kaga the screenshot of Sana’s message because (paraphrasing) “They started the PM for my protection so the members would gossips behind my back.” I wrote out a decently long reply during which I again admitted I fucked up, but standing by my actions and went into details about why I did what I did. The message was seemingly ignored because the next response was Ray basically telling me I’m a piece of shit and informing me the mods voted to a character ban.
I said that if the mods wanted to do that they could, but that I would take the action I am now and leave the site, though not necessarily the discord. I went on to explain how I felt ignored, how no argument or feeling I had out forward in anything and been addressed, I talked about why I pushed back so hard on nerfs against my character, again pulling up Rucho’s hollow as an example. I talked about how I had tried to move forward with a good foot, but how it was seemingly being ignored despite my misstep. Zk replied, largely, point though there was still no acknowledgement of my argument about Rucho’s hollow and the only feeling that got addressed was my anger that Sana felt the need to make her point by point PM in which he basically said “Your actions need consequences”, which, while true, did nothing to justify Sana’s message. At some point I was told the PM was meant to put forward the verdict of the mods about banning my character, though I felt this was false. If the thread had been just about handing down a punishment I feel Ray’s message would have been the first one put forward, not Sana’s, or even if it had been a review of my behavior beforehand it would have taken a more professional tone instead of the shitty one that was given. I still haven’t heard back about this.
I replied, point by point, like Zk did, to his message, though after a bit less than 48 hours I sent another message saying that I’m assuming I wasn’t going to get a reply and that I wanted to mods to taken the ban announcement public. They said it can be taken public, though there was a miscommunication about who would be doing it, I thought the mods would, they thought I would. For fairness reasons I told them I want the thread to be able to replied to so I could correct anything I found inaccurate. They told me I could do it myself and that the PM’s again had been for my benefit, though I still doubt this. Sana replied once more once I said I was going public saying the PM had also been so that a public scene wasn’t made, though I found that argument to be largely invalid by the scene that was already made in the CIU. I would like to post scene shots of the messages that were sent because i think it shows I was really trying to move on and the mods weren’t willing to, but I very much doubt they would approve their release.
That’s the story up to this point. I’ve told it as impartial as I could and owned up in areas where I think I fucked up, though I refrained from pointing out areas where I feel the mods fucked up because I feel it wouldn’t really accomplish much accept piss them off and open the pandora’s box that is “what if”. I was informed in Zk’s last message that the ban may be lifted at a future date, and maybe if it is I’ll come back to RP, though I’m not sure I will, and if I did it would be because of people like Col, who through this entire shit show, has been the one helpful person in this entire ordeal.
